Ask Me Anything: Outsourced Legal Marketing Services | Legal Internet Solutions Inc.


More and more, law firms of all sizes are choosing to outsource some or all of their legal marketing. As leaders in Outsourced Legal Marketing Services, the LISI recently hosted an “Ask Me Anything” livestream on LinkedIn to answer questions about all things marketing outsourcing. Why might it make sense for your firm? How do you decide what to outsource and what to keep in house? How does it work? What’s the best recipe for success?

Please watch video here.

– Hi everyone. Welcome to LISI’s live stream, “Ask me Anything About Outsourced Legal Marketing.” My name is Robyn Addis. I’m the chief operating officer and chief marketing and business development officer at LISI, joined by my amazing colleague, Kristyn Brophy, who is LISI’s director of client strategy. Hi Kristyn.

– Hi Robyn, how are ya?

– Living the dream girlfriend, living the dream. First, oh yeah, no you go.

– Okay. Before we start, I just want to wish everyone a happy dress up your pet day. And I’m curious how my little Patriots fan is doing out there in Pennsylvania.

– So friends, quick story. Kristyn came to Pennsylvania for our LISI week in December, our strategy and planning session for 2022, for all of our stuff and client stuff. And she put her Patriots hat on my dog. My cute, adorable dog who, let’s just be honest is ashamed. She was ashamed.

– No. She loved it. She was riding the Mac Jones train.

– Okay, well, she’ll be sporting her Eagle’s hat later when my children get home and bring it home from school.

– Nope, she is going to be rooting for the Patriots tomorrow night in their playoff game, so.

– Okay, fair, fine, whatever.

– Anyway.

– Yeah, anyway, so anybody who’s on with us right now in the live stream, drop us a hello in the comments, just say hi, let us know you’re here. And we received some questions in advance of the program. So thank you to anybody who sent those questions in. We’re going to address those first, and we want to make sure that we address your questions as well. Also use the comment section to add your questions in, and we’ll try to get to them. We’re thinking maybe like you know, 30, 20-30 minutes, we’ll see what happens, but we don’t have a hard stop. So if we get a lot of good conversation and people have a lot of questions, we’re happy to stay on as long as, oh, hello my friend Andrew. We’re happy to stay on as long as anybody wants to listen to us talk. So first question, how do you make a business case, Kristyn? How do you make a business case for, well, I’m sorry. Let’s not even do that one yet. I skipped over. How about you just level set for us, what is outsourced legal marketing?

– Yeah, absolutely. Outsourced legal marketing can mean many, many things. It kind of depends on what your needs are and what you’re looking to outsource, what you’re looking to keep in house. Outsourced legal marketing is kind of everything. Are you looking for outsourcing your business development efforts, but keeping marketing in-house? Are you looking to outsource your digital marketing efforts, but keep your business development in house? Are you looking to only do social media? Are you looking to only outsource your email marketing? So outsourced legal marketing could mean a whole bunch of different things depending on what is right for you and your firm.

– Yep, that’s a great answer. And then kind of piggybacking on that, there are so many providers. I talk with Jill Huse from Society 54 all the time. We always have this sort of mentality: There’s plenty of business out there. There’s lots of people who do the same thing, but there’s lots of business out there too. So how do you decide which provider is best for you? You were recently at Conn Kavanaugh in Boston and you were a solo marketer. If you had the opportunity to outsource some of your marketing, what would you have done? What, how would you have gone about making that decision?

– Well, I would have maybe started tracking my time, because I wasn’t tracking my time when I was at Conn Kavanaugh, and seeing where I could have used the most amount of help and where it would have made sense for me to be spending more of my time, my valuable time and Conn Kavanaugh’s valuable money, for example. When I was there, I was doing everything. Jane of all trades, right? I was wearing many hats. I did the digital marketing. I did the email marketing. I did all of the graphic design work. I did all of the website updates and maintenance. I did business development coaching and training and lunch and learns, the list could go on forever. And I loved my job. I loved Conn Kavanaugh, but it was a lot to do. And now luckily Conn Kavanaugh is one of our clients, and they outsource their social media and a lot of their content marketing to us. So their in-house director of marketing and business development, Christina Lamb can focus on those really heavy hitting business development initiatives, especially for the more junior partners and senior associates to help them build their books of business. And she doesn’t have to get bogged down in the minutia of posting something to social media or doing a small website update here and there. She outsources those efforts, and those are kind of the same efforts that I probably would have outsourced are the same ones that Christina is now outsourcing, having filled in my place there at Conn Kavanaugh. And I would’ve really loved the help I guess, and by tracking all of that data… So going back to kind of what I was saying in the beginning, tracking my time, taking that data, and really measuring what would be the right choice for me personally to outsource, would kind of help in choosing an agency and choosing what type of marketing I’m looking to get from elsewhere.

– Yeah. I think it’s like any business case that you have to make in a law firm. Look, my experience is mostly in big law. I came from two very large firms with very well-staffed departments. I also still say there’s more work than any legal marketing department could ever do. There just is! Just because you are a a 500-attorney firm with 40 legal marketers in a bunch of different functions, there’s still more work that can always be done. So going back to building a business case, I think you hit the nail on the head. Having that data and the information, lawyers like evidence. I think we all know that. And so having that data and information and that evidence to show look, I’m spending you know, we get a lot of traction, let’s say on social media. So I put a lot of effort into our social media, but that means that I don’t have time to potentially as a solo marketer, do you know, graphic design and improve our pitch and proposal materials, or I don’t have time to make sure that our content calendar is you know, stay on top of people who are responsible for providing content. And those are just a couple really quick short examples, but you know, the more that you have that evidence the better in any case, I mean truly.

– Absolutely.

– Yeah. One of the questions is how much is outsourced marketing. I mean really there’s, I don’t have a great answer for you for this. I know obviously we provide outsource marketing. I know how we structure our deals, but I also say every single time I meet with a prospective client, I don’t have just like a one size fits all option. We understand what your needs are. We take a look at our data and the amount of time it would take us to invest our resources in providing those solutions. And then we come up with a custom proposal. So it really depends on how much, or you know, much or little of your marketing you want to outsource, how much time that really comes down to. And another question that was a great question from Cynthia McCullough is how long does a typical project take? You know, if there is a typical, that really relates, and that’s a great question. There’s not really a typical. Sometimes it is “I need you to,” “I need you to come in and overhaul our social media stuff.” And that’s really what the request was. So, “help us come up with a strategic marketing, social media plan, and help us come up with a content calendar. And how do we repurpose our content, and how do we come up with templates that we can use and reuse for our social media graphic templates?” So that project had a beginning, a middle and an end. Other projects are, “I need you just to be my legal marketing department,” and that hopefully will go on forever because well, I’m going to put an asterisk on that and come back to it. But that will go on for a long time because we’re setting a strategy, we’re working on it throughout the year, and then we’re coming back, reviewing the strategy, setting a new strategy, and moving forward. One thing I do want to say here, and then I’ll take a breath, is we also have lots of people who come in and say “okay, I’m looking to grow my firm, and I have an ad out, and I want to hire an in-house legal marketer. And I don’t think I’m going to do outsource legal marketing for forever.” Okay. But you need to be doing marketing now too. And so let us help you build out that infrastructure, let us help you understand what that should look and feel like. So if your ultimate decision is to bring that in-house, which I get, that makes sense for some firms that you have a starting point from which a solo marketer and eventually, hopefully a growing team can build upon as opposed to coming in and having to figure it all out themselves, because that’s just really overwhelming.

– Exactly. So to kind of piggyback off of that I, one of our clients and one of the clients I work very closely with says that they want to put themselves out of business because they’re doing such a good job, right. With all of their legal issues. And that’s similar to I guess, kind of my belief in outsourced legal marketing when you’re saying like a firm comes to us and says you know, I don’t want to outsource my legal marketing forever. I want to grow. It’s like okay, we want to help you build those tools to succeed and grow to that point where you can have an in-house marketing team. We don’t want to put ourselves out of business, but we do want to help you grow. And we recognize that those engagements aren’t always a forever thing.

– Exactly. A hundred percent. Let me go back over here to some of these questions. So this is a good one. We got a lot of questions in advance about content generation. And I think that this obviously goes beyond just outsourced legal marketing, but when we’re working with our clients, we really take a three-pronged approach to how to come up with content. What content is the lawyer or the practice or the firm generating on its own? What, in some cases, what content are other areas of the firm? So if it’s a lawyer-specific or it’s a practice-specific, how can you cross market, and what are some of the topic areas in a related practice that you can leverage when you’re marketing your practice. And then we also look to third-party content. So of course, getting quoted in a publication is amazing and all of that stuff, right? And that pull-through messaging is important, but there are, it’s also especially more and more we’re in a world where social media and that third-party proof, social proof is really where it’s at. The more that you can use third-party content to reinforce your own messaging and your own content development, even if you’re not necessarily quoted in it, the better. Again, we don’t need to go down the rabbit hole of things you have to think about in that case. But it’s important to, I think, draw from multiple sources than just churning out content all the time, lawyers are going to get exhausted and it’s not going to work. So the more that you can diversify your content sources and your content streams, the better. Don’t you think Kristyn?

– Absolutely. And I mean, I do that myself. I have this series on LinkedIn that I started #FridayFavorite where I take a piece of marketing that isn’t done by LISI, that isn’t done by me, that isn’t done by one of our clients, that’s done somewhere else. And I use that as part of my content strategy because it’s building examples of what we can do for our clients, and showcase these really great examples of marketing that are out there. And that’s just kind of one example of pulling content from elsewhere. We can take articles from these third-party sources, we follow content syndicators, like JD Supra or something, and we can gather all sorts of information, and that way we’re not burning ourselves out, but then we can also sprinkle in some soft content things. So like today, for example, as we started out with, today’s national dress up your pet day, or just dress up your pet day. Have you know, all of your attorneys at the firm send pictures of their pets dressed up, and there’s your soft content posts to fill up those gaps in your content calendar.

– Yeah. You know, something it dawned on me that I didn’t fully address a couple of minutes ago is you know, when you’re thinking about how to choose the right provider. And like I said, there’s lots of providers out there, and I think a lot of them do a really good job. And so you know, I think it comes down to what are your goals? And I would ask myself is this: do I think that this is a short-term thing, is this a fill-in thing? Is this a, just help me get through a period like of growth or something, or is this a long-term partnership? I want somebody who’s a peer, who can really help challenge the way I see things. And you know, again, we have clients along that spectrum, but then you marry that question with, what are the services that you, have gaps on your team? So I just talked to a friend at a firm the other day, who was looking for business development support. Like really, really needs business development coaching. So that’s not something that we provide. So we were able to refer, refer that to a friend of ours in the legal marketing community. And because there are providers out there who really do focus more heavily on the business development, and there might be overlap. You know, in this case, there is overlap with some of the things that we do, but being able to have that partnership with the right agency will help actually bring in additional resources that might be a good fit for specific things, because we, on the agency side, you might not realize it, but we on the agency side have our own sort of network and community so that we can refer business to one another, that we can pull in resources from other agencies to help fill in gaps that we might have. So outsourcing in a way, I guess the point I’m getting to is that outsourcing actually opens you up potentially to a whole universe of talent and information and resources that you might not even realize that you have at your fingertips. So picking the right agency is picking one that is, that is open to that sort of community into that network.

– Yeah, absolutely. And I noticed another question we got ahead of time that kind of piggybacks off of this: is what are some of the benefits of outsourcing? And one of those benefits is you get these diverse skillsets, you get this team of different backgrounds, different strategies, different ideas. When I was a solo marketer, I was struggling with not having a team to bounce ideas off of, and by outsourcing that could have resolved a lot of that.

– Yeah.

– And I really leaned heavily on LMA to bounce some ideas off of, or Legal Marketing Association. But it wasn’t quite the same as having that team, whether it be in-house or an outsourced team of people I could just talk to and work with.

– Yeah. One thing, I think that it’s really important to talk about in terms of benefit, is also an outsource team, we talk about LMA, and LMA is a great resource. We’re both obviously long-time volunteers with LMA and anybody who’s involved with LMA knows that it is a very strong network. It is a very tight community and it’s very open. And it’s an open community where people do a really nice job of sharing information freely, which is kind of unique I think in our line of business. And if you think about that in terms of on the outsourcing side too, again, on that point of the information and the resources, it is an outsourced agency’s JOB to stay in the know. To stay ahead of what is happening in any area that they say that they specialize in. So if they do search engine optimization or search engine marketing, knowing how or having the resources or tools and information to understand how the algorithm is changing and how pay-per-click, for example, it might be changing, or staying on top of social media algorithms, and understands how to leverage different platforms. I had a question, I’m going to go off on a like a really quick tangent for two seconds. I was asked a question by a lawyer yesterday you know, “do I, I’ve heard two different schools of thought, do I accept every LinkedIn invitation I ever get? Or do I only accept the invitations from people that I know?” And it was interesting because my counterpart inside the firm, the director of client relations and I both agreed that this has changed. This approach has changed from you know, early on it was only ever accept people, invitations from people you know. And now there’s a business case, there’s a reason to potentially accept invitations beyond that. I know this isn’t about LinkedIn, so I don’t need to go into that. But that point is you know, I make it my job to stay on top of what is happening with LinkedIn. What is happening with social media, how to push the envelope on email marketing, and all of these things. And that’s what your agency is out there to do for you. Because look, I’ve been in house at a firm before, everybody here has. Everybody I should say at LISI has. And so we know how hard it is to, you want to be strategic, and you want to be forward thinking and proactive. Sometimes you just don’t have the time. So the benefit is really how do you, how do you use the outside agency to shift the balance so it’s not all reactive, that you can get more proactive, and they are there for you. Another thing, sorry. Now I’m up on my soap box as Kristyn laughs at me for. Another thing that’s really important to think about with your agency. And I feel really strongly about this, is that the agency… the best outsourced arrangement in my professional opinion, is one where the agency is driving output, and output’s not the right word. The agency is driving outcomes. So I don’t want to see anybody. If anybody on this is thinking of working with an outside agency, it is not going to make your job easier if it’s just a pool of people to hand stuff off to. You know, the best arrangement, and again, in my opinion, is one where it is truly a partnership. And it’s you know, the agency is holding you accountable to your strategic marketing plan, and you are getting what you need from them. Of course, like you are handing work off to them, but it is a balance again of how that work is coming together and how it’s getting done. Because if you just have some you know, if you’re just handing off like hey, I need this thing done. And that’s all, without bringing in sort of that strategic and that creative, whatever, creativity to it. I don’t know if the value is fully there. Does that make sense? Am I rambling at this point, Kristyn?

– No. No, that totally made sense. Meaning yes that made sense. No, you were not rambling. I didn’t mean to just say no. Off the bat. Ugh you know.

– I know, I know. It’s one of those days.

– It is.

– Yeah. What other questions does everybody have? I mean, I could get up on my soapbox for I don’t know, hours about this. ‘Cause I love what we do in it, and I love the work that we do. I think from my perspective, the thing that I love about being on the agency side of it, on the outsourced side of it is I get to meet with so many different teams. I love being a connector. So you know, I love, for example, my follow Friday post today was about Breana Moore, who’s a marketing coordinator at Morris James in Delaware. And you know, just helping her connect with people who can continue to help her skills, grow and develop. That’s really fulfilling for me. That’s really enjoyable for me. So I love doing that. And it’s different every day. It’s different, like Kristyn said, I think on last week’s live stream, it was like by Wednesday everybody woke up, and it was like holy cannoli, but it was fun. Yeah, it’s like you know, it’s that adrenaline rush of fun though. It’s really enjoyable. Don’t you think?

– Exactly. Oh yeah, absolutely. I’m having a blast, and you know yes, of course our days are long. Our days are crazy, but I wouldn’t have it any other way. I was a theater major in college. Those days were long. Those days were crazy. I don’t know anything else.

– I know right.

– Yeah.

– I know. Okay. Oh, I’m looking at our questions. Oh Kristyn, was there something else? Did I skip over a point for you that you wanted to add in?

– Well I was just kind of going back to the research of how we’re always staying on top of everything. I just, it’s very true, and if I don’t understand something, somebody at the agency does, or somebody that the agency has that you know, foundation of skills or that foundational knowledge to learn a skill quicker than I could. So for example, I was having a heck of a time with a website, with an issue on a website. So I could just reach out to Keith, who is our, who’s on our team. And he does all of our backend website stuff. He’s much better at this than I am. So I was able to reach out to him and just be like I am stuck. I don’t know what I’m doing. Please help. And he was able to help. And then not only did I learn a new skill after struggling through that, but I was able to lean on a member of my team. And I think that’s a huge benefit to anybody who uses an agency.

– Yeah. Yeah. We just got a, I agree with you by the way. And we just got a great question and Joanne, I’m so glad that you asked this question. Metrics are critical to show value and progress, and to our attorneys and to help make a case for outsourcing tasks and projects, what is the best way to capture everything we’re doing? Okay, so.

– That’s a good question.

– That is such a good question. And I love this question. So there’s, the almost the problem is there are so many resources and tools out there, it’s like where do you even start? My personal opinion is having some sort of marketing automation tool. We use HubSpot at LISI. We like it a lot for this reason, that aggregates all of your data into one place. So, in HubSpot example, We have our marketing We have all of our contacts We have all of our companies We all have all of our business development pipeline. We have our email marketing activity. And we have our social media marketing activity. And our website performance. It all feeds into one central system. HubSpot does this, But the point being that if you can normalize that data, meaning make it so it is weighted, and comparable across systems and across data and information feeds, that if you can bring that all into one place, and you can be able to show a dashboard and I sort of cringe at the word dashboard, ’cause I know that’s like everybody’s favorite word sometimes. “Dashboard for this!” But if you do have a dashboard, a board where you can pull all of that information in, that’s really critical. The other thing that’s really important is setting out, at the beginning of the engagement, setting out very, obviously a very clear scope, and a very clear goals, strategies, tactics, and measures of success. So we do this, and if anybody wants to look at our strategic marketing tamp plan template, it’s on our website and it’s outlined exactly like this. So when we write strategic marketing plans, we write goals, like what is the big thing that we’re trying to accomplish, and the strategy, how are we going to accomplish it? The tactics, the details of that, of those strategies, by doing X number of things 10 times or two to three times a week, whatever it is, and getting very, getting very specific. And then how are we going to measure success? So I’m probably going to muddle this off on the top of my mind, but like if your goal is to grow subscribers. So the strategy is to send email you know, X times per month send this you know, and then maybe the tactic is you’ve got a newsletter, and you’ve got an informational piece and you’ve got an award or whatever. Those aren’t great examples, but you know what I’m saying. And then the measures of success are you know, how many people are clicking through to your website? How many people are subscribing? That’s obviously a measure of success. How many people are interacting with that email, etc. Again, I sort of did this on the fly. So I hope that made sense, but it’s, you really have to lay those out in a very specific way. I always talk about smart goals, Specific, Measurable, Attainable, Realistic, and Time-based. That really goes back to that. Kristyn, did you want to say something?

– No, you’ve pretty much covered everything I was going to cover. And I guess kind of just piggybacking off of that. Wow, piggybacking has been my word today.

– Yeah.

– Anyway, piggybacking off of that, I, you know, I did see Andrew had asked a question as well about, you know, helping clients get the value from data that’s generated off the back of the content. You know, GC from X company is consuming our content and we should reach out to them. We, you know, as part of the strategic marketing plan that Robyn was talking about, we also have all of these KPIs that we put together, and you know, she was referencing how many people are clicking on your content? How many people are opening your emails, although, you know, email open rates since iOS updated, isn’t the best measure of success anymore. But we’re looking at all of this data, tracking these key performance indicators, KPIs, and then we’ll take something like this you know, GC from X company is consuming your content. We see that in a, in a platform like HubSpot or with a tool like HubSpot. And then we can kind of set up automated processes to bring that GC through your sales funnel. So maybe, you know, they click on something on your website and it triggers an automated email to say oh, we noticed you were clicking on X, Y, Z, or you clicked on this blog post. Would you be interested in this free white paper, because you’ve been visiting our content. So it’s kind of just a way to automatically reach out to people based on the data that you’re collecting and those you know, that performance. Maybe he, this GC, he or she is going to multiple pages on the website. And they’ve been reading your emails, they subscribe to your email list, and they start following you on social media, and they returned to your website repeatedly over the next few months. That’s when that automation should then trigger to be like hey, I’ve noticed that you’ve been reading a lot of our stuff. You sign up for email list. We’ve sent you a couple free white papers or blog posts or articles, relevant information, and maybe we should get together and have coffee you know, have someone, a person at the firm actually reach out and say yeah, we’ve noticed this. I’d love to just have a chat. You know, don’t try to sell them anything, just have a conversation.

– Yeah. I mean, and I love that question from Andrew. I think everything that Kristyn said, I 100% agree with. And I also think there is an element of course that’s like off-platform. So we make it our business to know what your growth goals are. Like and we ask this on our kickoff, you know, are you looking to grow? Are you looking to maintain status quo? If you are looking to grow, do you have specific areas that you’re trying to grow in? So that when you know, let’s say in Andrew’s example, GC from XYZ company, does that fit into that target market? You know, that we can flag that. And again, maybe that goes off platform. Automations are, I could oh God, there’s so many things I could get so nerdy about, but yes, if we could set up automations with your marketing automation tool, that is a great way to simplify the process. But also that only goes so far, especially the sort of the higher end your legal services get, the more sophisticated the communication needs to be, and the quicker it’s going to go off platform. So, and when I say off platform, meaning like outside of the email marketing queue, and it gets hand delivered to a relationship partner or somebody who’s going to make it their actual task and personal business to follow up with that. And a great marketing automation tool will also have tasks that can you know, help both on the marketing side and the business development side to keep things going. I got got to excellent question privately. So anonymously, this question was asked, how do you respond to clients who are concerned that you work with their competitors? Excellent question. And that is challenging.

– Yes.

– So the fact of the matter is like I mean, I think everybody does this. I don’t think we’re special for doing this. We do sign confidentiality agreements with everybody that we work with. Obviously we’re going to be keeping things confidential, but there are certain areas where we just won’t compete. It is Jason Lisi, our founder, it is his ethos. And we all agree with this. There are just some things we can’t compete against ourselves. We can’t have clients competing in the same area, for example, for paid search for a very specific topic. It just makes more sense. So we address, we specifically address that question that way. But in the areas where it is you know, where we do our best to not compete, and we do our best to refer out work that is truly a competitive situation. And we have done that. But in some cases you can’t, you couldn’t do a noncompete with every single firm. You’d only have like seven firms that you could work with. And when I, you know, I’m not, I don’t think I’m doing a good job explaining this right now, but really the way I address that concern is I have a candid conversation. What is it about the competition that you don’t want? What is it specifically? Can we narrow the focus of that non-compete, can we get more specific about it? And honestly, just having an open conversation about it has always worked for me because people understand we’re a business, we’re trying to make money too, and we want to help them grow. And we have no interest in competing against ourselves in a market with two clients. It’s in our best interest to serve you both best individually, and how can we do that in an arrangement that makes sense for everybody. A little bit of a convoluted answer, but I do think that was an important question and I wanted to address it. Kristyn, I have to read another private question, fill in, tell us a story about, oh, you know what, I think one thing that’s really great about outsourced marketing and you we’re on the front lines of this, handling sort of emergency response situations. So when you’ve got something that’s happening and you have to be responsive, how are you, I know the answer, but tell our audience, how are you able as an outsource marketer to sort of fill in those gaps, and help keep things moving?

– Exactly, all right. So we have and almost every agency out there, if not every agency out there, has a toolbox of technologies. I sent in a blog post that I recently wrote for LISI. I think it was published what today, yesterday?

– Today.

– Today. Oh, excellent. But I said in the blog posts that we’re like your Mary Poppins with tricks up our sleeves and just a bag full of endless tools at our disposal. And I’m able to take all of these tools and then just disseminate content simultaneously across multiple channels at the snap of a finger, which helps in that emergency response. So like say we have a client that does personal injury and they like to you know, do what we call an emergency response to these big catastrophic events. And we put a nice quote out there and say that our heartfelt thoughts and prayers go to the families and then we’ll actually do a data grab, and we’ll grab some data from the news outlets and the news resources and tweeted out there from the firm’s Twitter account. And then we’ll get posts on LinkedIn. And then we’ll get in the news from a press release and work with another actual agency that works with this client that gets you know, PR Newswire notifications out there. And then we also put it on Facebook and then we get it up on Instagram. Maybe we’ll do an Instagram live if it makes sense to do that. We put something in the Instagram stories so there’s a link that you can go back to. Maybe we go up on LinkedIn live with it. I mean, there are just so many endless possibilities with our toolkit that we can just do this and be out in multiple channels all over the place. And I think a great point that you made in that article, which I hadn’t even really thought about, although it’s sort of I guess it’s obvious, I hadn’t thought about it until you wrote it. Was that we are able as an outsourced agency to bring resources to bare that have a cost associated with them. But because we have, for example, we’re using stream yard right now to do our LinkedIn live. If we facilitate that for a client, there’s no additional cost for the platform to our client. We’re just able to use our platform to do a live broadcast. And you know, those things add up. There are a handful of things that I can think of quickly, you know, that we can, that are not free to us, but because we can make them free because we’re using them and sharing them with our clients across the board, which is great.

– Exactly.

– Yeah. Well, I think our questions have died down and we’ve been talking for nearly 40 minutes. I wanted to say thank you to everybody for joining us today. And thank you for letting us get a little bit nerdy. I think I’m sure it came across that we really love what we do and we get excited about it. If you are thinking, if you’re using an outsource provider and you, or you’re thinking of using an outsource provider, please believe me when I say, I just like people to find the right resource. Maybe it’s LISI, maybe it’s not. I love talking to people about you know, what they’re looking for and helping, like I said before, connect them with the right resource. ‘Cause it’s not always us. So if you just need like a brain to bounce things off of, Kristyn and I are always both so happy to do that as well. We just like being a part of this community and to give back in that way. So feel free to reach out to us. You can reach out to us via it’s either Robyn, or in Kristyn’s case, Kristyn, at or connect with us and follow us on LinkedIn. And I just want to say thank you to everybody, and have a great rest of your day. Bye.

– Yes, thank you everyone.

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